Welcome to Toy Business Unboxed Podcast, where we explore the journeys and insights of some of the most innovative minds in the toy and game industry. In this episode, Jason Hsieh sits down with David Wheeler, founder of Dragon’s Lair and a retail pioneer with nearly four decades of experience running specialty gaming and comic book stores. From opening his first location as a college student to building a multi-city franchise with a data clearing house that serves the entire industry, David has a perspective that few in this space can match. This conversation is packed with lessons on community, collaboration, and what it really means to build a business that lasts.
#159: From One Comic Store to a Multi-City Franchise – Toy Business Unboxed
Episode Highlight
- 00:00 Host introduces David Wheeler
- 00:49 Little John the store advisor
- 01:09 Opening first store in 1986
- 02:42 Three generations of retail stores
- 05:34 Hardest part of franchising
- 07:23 Tips for indie publishers
- 14:14 Consolidated Data Clearing House explained
- 17:46 Scent branding strategy revealed
- 19:45 Franchise investment costs discussed
- 21:58 Finance and no-discounting advice
How a College Student Turned a Passion Into a 39-Year Retail Career
David Wheeler’s journey in retail began long before he ever opened a store. As a high school student, he spent free time in local comic book and science fiction shops, helping owners organize shelves and playing chess. By the time he was attending the University of Texas at Austin, he had already worked at two stores that eventually closed. Rather than walk away from the industry, he walked toward it and opened Dragon’s Lair in 1986 on 35th and Guadalupe in Austin. What started as a student passion project has grown into one of the most iconic brands in specialty gaming and comic retail.
Three Generations of Comic and Game Stores
David frames the evolution of specialty retail in three distinct generations that reflect how professional the industry has become. First-generation stores from the 1970s and early 1980s ran on minimal budgets, often using grocery store discards as fixtures and serving only the most dedicated fans. Second-generation stores improved their organization and layout but still lacked consistent branding and lighting. Third-generation stores, where most modern shops operate today, prioritize location, professional fixtures, wall washing lights, scent, and branded uniforms. This shift reflects an industry that now competes directly with mall retailers and wants to welcome customers who expect a polished experience.
Building a Franchise Model That Creates Win-Win Outcomes
The decision to franchise grew from a practical challenge when David needed to relocate for personal reasons while still leveraging the relationships and knowledge he had built over 25 years in Austin. Rather than becoming a distant owner, he created a system that gave his existing managers the opportunity to become owners themselves. David’s approach is rooted in non-zero-sum thinking, meaning he consistently looks for ways that all parties can benefit from any arrangement. That philosophy extends beyond internal operations to his broader relationships with publishers, distributors, and fellow retailers. The franchise model lets him keep contributing to the industry while empowering others to build businesses of their own.
Advice for Indie Publishers Trying to Get Into Retail
David acknowledges that retailers like him are constantly flooded with pitches from publishers and manufacturers, which makes standing out difficult. His first piece of advice is to start locally, visiting nearby stores and arranging one-on-one meetings with managers or owners rather than blasting out mass emails. Beyond local outreach, he encourages publishers to find stores that specialize in independent games, toys, or comics and reach out to those directly. He cites a publisher who visited hundreds of stores in person, which made a lasting impression on everyone she met even if it was not the most cost-effective approach. The lesson is that personal connection still matters in a world of digital outreach.
How Retailers Choose What to Stock
Inventory decisions at Dragon’s Lair are driven primarily by customer input and historical sales trends rather than publisher pitches. David emphasizes that even stores within the same city can have very different best-sellers based on the people who shop there. For example, his San Antonio location in the medical center does strong business with action figures, while the Alamo Ranch location has a completely different mix. Asking customers directly about their interest in potential new products is a key strategy for building loyalty while making smarter buying decisions. This local intelligence is often far more valuable than any catalog a publisher can send.
The Consolidated Data Clearing House: Connecting the Industry
One of David’s most impactful contributions to the specialty retail world is the Consolidated Data Clearing House, a free database that centralizes information from publishers, manufacturers, and distributors in one place. Rather than forcing retailers to hunt down contact details, freight levels, and discount structures individually, the database puts it all in a single spreadsheet. Currently populated with data from approximately 182 publishers and manufacturers, it also includes FAIR direct links, demo program contacts, and catalog information. The project started as something David built for his own franchisees, but he opened it to outside retailers to give publishers an incentive to fill in their own data. Access is available through a request form on his website, keeping the resource focused on the retail community rather than general consumers.
Creating an Immersive Store Experience That Keeps Customers Coming Back
David has invested deliberately in the sensory and visual experience of his stores to make them feel like a destination. One memorable strategy is scent branding: subtle machines that emit a consistent fragrance throughout each location so that customers associate that smell with Dragon’s Lair the moment they walk in. When one store relocated, he moved the scent machine into the new space weeks early so the transition would feel familiar to loyal customers. Beyond scent, he has standardized professional flooring using vinyl tile or painted concrete instead of stain-prone carpet, improved lighting with wall washing fixtures, and maintained consistent brand colors across all franchise locations. These investments signal to anyone walking in that they are entering a professional, welcoming space built for the community.
Advice for Newcomers in the Toy and Game Industry
David’s top advice for anyone entering the industry is to build strong financial habits before the doors ever open. He recommends reading books on finance and setting up QuickBooks correctly before the first sale, because retroactively entering months of data is painful and error-prone. He also recommends reading “Why We Buy” by Paco Underhill to understand how consumers navigate physical spaces and what motivates them to engage with different areas of a store. One of the most important rules he passes on to potential franchisees is to never discount, because margins in specialty retail are simply too thin to absorb price cuts. Above all, he says that if you are only in it for return on investment, this is the wrong industry.
Conclusion
David Wheeler’s story is a masterclass in building a business around community rather than just product. Over nearly four decades, he has transformed a student passion project into a multi-city franchise, created a free industry resource connecting hundreds of publishers with retailers, and championed a collaborative model that benefits every layer of the supply chain. His non-zero-sum philosophy shows up in everything from how he structured his franchise model to how he shares data with competitors and partners alike. For anyone in the toy and game industry, his story is a reminder that lasting businesses are built on connection, generosity, and a genuine love for the work.
Connect with David Wheeler
If you’re interested in learning more about Dragon’s Lair LLC or connecting with David Wheeler you can reach out through the following channels:
- Website: Visit Dragon’s Lair LLC’s official website for the latest news, game updates, and more
- Facebook: Follow Dragon’s Lair LLC on Facebook for updates, discussions, and behind-the-scenes content.
- Email: Reach out directly at ceo@dlair.net for inquiries, collaboration and more.
Transcript
Jason Hsieh (00:00)
Welcome back to another episode of Toy Business Unboxed. Today’s guest, have a very unique background. He knows retail inside out from opening his first store in 1986 to growing the Dragon’s Lair and Comic Fantasy Empire into iconic brands and pioneering a franchise model that supports store owners across multiple cities. David also has spent more than 35 years creating spaces where fans can connect over comics, games, and also storytelling.
In this particular conversation, we’ll dive into his version for a more collaborative industry where publishers, manufacturers, and distributors and retailers can all come together, share information and resources for having mutual success. We’ll also explore how data can be a very powerful tool to strengthen the entire ecosystem within the toys and game industry. So thank you so much for being on our show today, David.
David Wheeler (00:49)
It’s a true pleasure to be here. And also, you as you can see, little John has joined us. He’s been my counselor over many of my decisions about Dragon’s Lair for the years, so it’s only appropriate.
Jason Hsieh (01:00)
I see. So I know you have been in retail for decades. What first inspired you to open your very own store back in 1986?
David Wheeler (01:09)
I had been in the industry in various ways even before 1986. when I was in high school, I would go over to the local comic book stores and science fiction bookstores and I would, you know, spend time playing chess with the owners and organizing their books and just enjoying the culture that they brought to things. When I got to college, I did like many of us did and followed someone we were interested in and got a job where they worked, which was not as creepy as it sounds.
Jason Hsieh (01:28)
I see.
David Wheeler (01:36)
We were good friends. I worked at two different stores, both of which unfortunately failed. Not because of me, just to clarify, but by the time that that second store failed, I already was deeply enmeshed in the culture of the industry. And it was just natural for me to go up to my the aforementioned friend.
Say how much do you think it would cost to open a comic and game store, turn around and walk off before they respond, just to leave them flabbergasted and gasping behind them. So yeah.
Jason Hsieh (02:05)
Okay. And where is this first location? What city, what state do you open the first location
David Wheeler (02:10)
I was still attending the University of Texas at Austin when I opened my store. in Austin on thirty fifth of Guadalupe. I do not recommend opening a game store or comic store while you were taking classes as an undergraduate. Yeah. It was not good for the store and it wasn’t good for my classes or grades. But, nevertheless, here I am
thirty nine years on. So I guess it worked out pretty well.
Jason Hsieh (02:34)
I see. But looking back, ⁓ how was it opening your own store? I believe the retail landscape is very different back then compared to now.
David Wheeler (02:42)
So it’s it certainly was. I like to discuss comic and game stores as three generations worth of stores. Okay. first generation is where, truthfully, in the 70s and early 80s, stores would open up with no funding. And, you the fixtures at the time were often grocery store discards. Because a lot of these stores opened as mom and pop stores.
Catering to the people who were deeply, deeply ensconced in the game and comic industries were fandoms. Second generation are a little above that. basically you start to see better organization and fixturing. But still, the stores tend to be dark and the fixtures don’t tend to be professional. Third generation is kind of where we are now, where most stores care about their location. They have very good fixturing.
They care about lighting and scent and, you know, have professionally branded uniforms of some sort. Yeah. So that we can not only appeal just to the entrenched fandoms, but also encourage people who are used to going to mall stores or higher end stores to come into our stores and experience what we can offer.
Jason Hsieh (03:51)
I see. Okay. That’s a very interesting transition that you shared. And how do you transition from running your own store to develop a whole franchise model around like running the store?
David Wheeler (04:01)
You know, generally it’s taking the best practices of the stores that are existing and codifying those so that new store owners can take those and adapt them to their own stores, as well as providing training for those store owners, so to say, have that background to go on. So that’s pretty how that transition happened. The impetus in my case was that my
⁓ ex partner developed some severe allergies that were affecting her in Austin. So we needed to move out of Austin and yeah. So I needed to have a way to still use the information and contacts that I garnered over at the time twenty five years. Yeah. And continue on the stores from there.
Jason Hsieh (04:42)
okay, okay. It was that also one of the reasons why you start looking into franchising the store as well? Okay.
David Wheeler (04:49)
Exactly.
Otherwise, I don’t believe that managers long term do particularly well as running a store where the owner is not local and is not in the store on a regular basis. Yeah. I feel like it tends to breed contempt for the owners from those managers and therefore having a system set up so that I could still have some income coming in from the stores that I had built from scratch.
While also giving the then managers the chance to be owners was better than trying to be a long distance owner.
Jason Hsieh (05:21)
Hm, okay. and have to be a win win situation for everyone involved too, right? So
David Wheeler (05:26)
I never like zero sum games. So I always look for a way that everyone can benefit and move forward in a positive manner.
Jason Hsieh (05:34)
I see. And what will you say is the hardest part? I have never created my own franchise yet, so that’s something like I would love to learn some of your journey and the lesson you learned so far.
David Wheeler (05:44)
Specifically, the hardest part of being a franchise is first off, finding people who have the financial wherewithal and the drive run a store. There are two things that I tell potential franchisees right off the bat without fail. And the first is this is a vocation as well as a job. If you’re only concerned about return on investment, you should open and look at different franchisees.
I usually throw Auntie Anne’s under the bus. because there you were dealing with very limited choices. So with a comic and game store or a toy store, you are probably looking at hundreds, if not thousands, of products every month that you’re going to be bringing in. So it’s very, challenging to
Jason Hsieh (06:22)
Yes.
David Wheeler (06:24)
Be aware of all those items. If you are dealing with an Auntie Anne’s or Wild Birds Unlimited, you know, you don’t have that many different types
Jason Hsieh (06:32)
the the skew is very limited, it’s always the same stuff.
David Wheeler (06:35)
Exactly, exactly. So if you don’t love this, you should do something else.
Jason Hsieh (06:39)
I see. That’s a very good recommendation.
David Wheeler (06:42)
Mm-hmm. The second thing I tell people is we are a very liberal franchise. we are very much about supporting the LGBTQIA plus communities and making our stores very welcoming and open to everyone to come in and you know participate in a healthy and respectful manner.
Jason Hsieh (07:02)
Yeah. And one of our core audience for our podcast is Indie Publisher was like store toy creator and designer. What would be your advice running so many different retail stores for those indie publisher on getting into the retail channel? What should they focusing on for their games and how should they even speak to store owners like yourself to kind of pitch their product to you as well?
David Wheeler (07:23)
That is really a challenge because we are overloaded with solicitations at all times.
And I’m not sure that I have the best advice for that. I would say first off, start local. So if you are in an area with stores, you know, start with those stores and try to arrange times to go in and meet one-on-one with either a manager or the store owner. Yeah. So that you can ⁓ share about your products. Okay. Beyond that, I would look for stores online that share your brand.
And reach out to those directly. one of the things that I believe Molly Zeff of goodness, her company’s name is escaping me right now. Sorry, Molly. ⁓ Is that ⁓ she actually went and visited hundreds of stores.
Jason Hsieh (08:08)
⁓ whoa, okay, okay, okay, yeah.
David Wheeler (08:10)
And that way she was able to connect one on one with people. That’s clearly not the most cost effective or ⁓ way to do that. Yeah. But it does make an impression. otherwise I would just call based ⁓ choose your efforts based upon stores that seem like they specialize in independent games or comic books or toys.
Jason Hsieh (08:31)
toys. I see. I see. I see. And on the store owner perspective, how do you choose and pick which inventory or which game to even carry on your shelf in your store?
David Wheeler (08:40)
We rely on our customers primarily. And historical trends in what kind of games appeal to our customers at each individual store.
Jason Hsieh (08:48)
Okay, okay. So it’s also location dependent, okay.
David Wheeler (08:51)
Yes, very much so. Even in the same city. I have two stores in San Antonio, one in Alamo Ranch and one in the medical center. The store in medical center does a huge amount of business with action figures, for example. But that is not necessarily the the case on the on the Alamo Ranch store and vice versa on other items. You really have to know your clientele and work with them directly as much as possible.
Jason Hsieh (09:03)
interesting. Okay.
Mm, I see, I see. That’s definitely very different. So okay. Go ahead.
David Wheeler (09:20)
And
it’s a great way to engage with your customers if you go up to them and say, Hey, we’re looking at bringing these in. Do you have an interest? so there’s a lot of interaction between store owners and our customers to determine that sort of thing.
Jason Hsieh (09:33)
I see. And based on your experience over the decade, what has been some of the biggest shifts that you see in the retail space, especially in the comic gaming space, over the years since you started?
David Wheeler (09:44)
Right. I mean certainly given that I’ve been around for so many years, you know, when we started off, a lot of stores did not even use cash registers. A lot of stores were doing everything by pen and pencil even after computer systems became available.
Jason Hsieh (10:01)
interesting. Okay.
David Wheeler (10:02)
One of the things that DC comics did for a lot of retailers is they made computer systems available to us to encourage retailers to become much more professional. Okay. So sort of like where I was talking about the first through third generation stores, first generation stores did not use any sort of automation to help them be more efficient and profitable. ⁓ So that’s been a big change.
Jason Hsieh (10:23)
I see, yeah.
Mm,
okay, okay, okay. Yeah, definitely a lot of different technology over the years as well.
David Wheeler (10:32)
Similarly, thankfully, the yellow pages that we used to have to pay huge amounts of money for ⁓ no longer exist really as a viable force in the industry. So most of the advertising that I do now and marketing that I do is done via social media.
Jason Hsieh (10:48)
⁓ okay. Okay. Which social media do you use that’s so effective? That’s so many of them.
David Wheeler (10:52)
Yeah, we actually use some aggregator programs to send out a message to multiple ⁓ social media groups. Blue Sky, and many other social media X, but formerly known as Twitter. Yeah.
Jason Hsieh (11:06)
Do you also run advertising on some of those channels? If so, which one are you focusing your advertising budget on?
David Wheeler (11:11)
Probably Facebook. ⁓ Facebook, though there are generational issues, it is nevertheless a pretty good location to send a message out. Okay. And for better or worse, it seems to have the easiest method of doing advertising.
Jason Hsieh (11:20)
I see.
Mm-hmm. I see. And what role do you see as far as collaboration between not just the retailer but also the manufacturers, the distributors and also the publishers all working together?
David Wheeler (11:38)
Well, as I mentioned earlier, I don’t believe in zero sum games. I see, especially in my industry, publishers are working more and more directly with retailers and offering retailers superior terms, lower free freight levels, better discounts than they have in the past.
Okay. So this is a place where retailers and publishers can work together for our mutual benefit. same with distributors in different ways and different extents. I mean, in the games industry especially and in the comics industry, we tend to know everyone in the industry. Okay and I suspect that that to some extent follows in the toy industry as well. Yeah. So your reputation matters.
Jason Hsieh (12:16)
Yeah
David Wheeler (12:19)
For better worse, if you have a good reputation, publishers and distributors are more willing to work for you, work with you. And so you can offer things like enhanced visibility in your stores to publishers in return for better terms and discounts. And since we demo a lot of games, we can also offer that to them as well.
Jason Hsieh (12:35)
Mm-hmm.
I see. Okay. Can you share some like real life example on how you work with like other people in the industry to help create a win win situation? Yeah.
David Wheeler (12:49)
So we’re currently working with the producers of HEXploreIt to bring their products into a couple of our stores. And in return, they’re offering us superior discounting and ⁓ offering us demo copies that we can put up and show people who come into the stores in advantageous positions. And in return, we provided them with pictures of the displays we’ve created. We are
spending money from the marketing fund that the franchise has to promote that their presence in our stores with through Facebook advertising. I think we’ve worked with some other partners to provide three minute loops. There’s a company called GameSale and I’ve been talking with GameSale to provide a three minute loop that we’re going to run in our stores for their games. so there are a lot of things that we can do together to help each other survive.
Similarly, and I may have lost my train of thought, we’ve also worked with companies like Stonemaier, who does Wingspan and Worm Span and Fin Span. Similarly in the past, and especially around holidays, and we’ve worked with Renegade Press and other companies in the same way.
Jason Hsieh (13:45)
Okay. Yeah.
Mm. I see, I see, I see. And next thing I want to kind of follow up or talk about is kind of be the data. What kind of data are you monitoring with like so many different franchise stores and so many locations? I think one of the pre show notes I have is you have a special program called Consolidated Data Clearing House. Can you kind explain what it is and how do you use it as a store owner?
David Wheeler (14:14)
And this again goes back to the idea that this is not a zero sum game. The consolidated list of publisher, manufacturer, and distributor data is essentially a place where publishers, manufacturers, and distributors can put as many details about their companies as possible in one place so that rather than retailers having to hunt down all the publishers and distributors’ data
individually, they can just go to this one list and see everything in a spreadsheet. So I have currently about 182 publishers and manufacturers that have shared their data with me. Yeah. That I then make available to other retailers. And there’s no cost for any of this. this is a labor of love and because I believe that it’s good for the industry. And this came out of the
fact that I was building this list anyway for my franchisees.
Jason Hsieh (15:04)
I see. Okay, okay, okay.
David Wheeler (15:06)
Selfishly, because I didn’t want to be the person tracking down all this data on my own, yes. I made this available to publishers and manufacturers so that they had an incentive to fill in this data on their own. Because I was going to share it with so many other retailers.
Jason Hsieh (15:22)
I see. Okay, okay, okay, okay, okay. Is it mostly contact information, their catalog, or what is in the database?
David Wheeler (15:28)
All those things, but it also includes things like free freight levels. What the discounts are that they offer. if you are available through FAIR, what your FAIR link is so that instead of having to pay the general fare expense, retailers can go directly to your page and you avoid some of those costs. That’s a win for the publishers who are providing that information. Retailer locator data.
as you mentioned, catalog data. If you have people who go out and demo your games or comics, where retailers can find that information so they can set up events at their stores. Just pretty much anything that I could think of. It’s very much a kitchen sink approach, but I also have a place for publishers to put in things that they would like me to include, and I’ve added those things in over time. This is really
Jason Hsieh (16:00)
I see.
Okay, okay.
David Wheeler (16:15)
Just all tiers of the industry working together so that we all benefit.
Jason Hsieh (16:19)
okay, okay, okay. Yeah, this is very interesting. And that’s actually kind of related to a project I was working on recently. I was looking into ⁓ Board Game Geek because they have about twenty-four thousand board game companies in their database and see how they manage all the data and see how they get track all the new publisher or the old publisher, you know, because they have so many in their database and it’s fully online. So that’s kind of related to a side project that I’m also doing right now. So that’s very interesting that you share that.
So and you share this data with all the franchisee?
David Wheeler (16:51)
Certainly all the franchisees. I also try to let retailers know about this so they can go to a page on my website, which is hidden. Basically, because this information is really designed for retailers. Yeah. I do not wish publishers to be inundated by questions from consumers.
Yeah. So you do have to go to this site
and request access, which I then just shared the page with you.
Jason Hsieh (17:14)
⁓ interesting. Yeah, I would love to see how you put that data together. That’s a very interesting data set for sure. Yeah. And of course over the years, like what are some of the I guess improvement that you have implemented across your store and ⁓ what are some of the exciting projects you’re working on for the upcoming years?
David Wheeler (17:19)
Happy to to do that.
I would say that when I started off, I had never taken any business classes. I was very ignorant when I opened the store. Some of the improvements I’ve done is as I’ve gone to trade shows and talked to experts. For example, I’ve implemented scent branding into my stores. Yeah, certainly. ⁓ so in the stores, there are machines that generate a scent that goes permeates the store.
Jason Hsieh (17:46)
You explain what that is.
Mm.
David Wheeler (17:56)
Okay. It’s very subtle and almost subliminal that you when you walk into the store, you smell that scent and you know that you are home.
Jason Hsieh (18:03)
okay, interesting strategy, okay.
David Wheeler (18:05)
Yeah, sort of the retail equivalent of ⁓ Realtors baking cookies.
Jason Hsieh (18:09)
okay, okay.
David Wheeler (18:10)
But for example, when we moved one of the stores, we actually moved one of these scent machines into the store a few weeks early and started it working. Yeah. So that when people transitioned from the old store to the new store, they would be greeted by the scent that they are very familiar with.
Jason Hsieh (18:27)
⁓ what kind of scent is it?
David Wheeler (18:29)
It does vary a little bit, but it’s often things like sandalwood, nutmeg, things like that. Okay.
Jason Hsieh (18:35)
So I see. I see. Okay, that’s a very interesting strategy. Any other like interesting thing you have tried that worked really well for the store?
David Wheeler (18:43)
I have researched basically flooring, for example. So we do not use carpet in our stores because carpet is bad. ⁓ People are inevitably going to spill things on it or it’s gonna get stained. It’s bad over time. One of the things I encourage my franchisees to do is to spend the extra money for a either a painted concrete look or a high grade vinyl
Jason Hsieh (18:46)
Okay.
Yeah, yeah. So
David Wheeler (19:08)
Tile often has sort of a wood look.
And again that fits in with the branding of the store. And ⁓ over time we have improved our fixtures, we’ve improved wall washing lights, we have become much more professional in our use of branded colors in our stores so that all the stores in the franchise have the same similar feel when you go into it.
Jason Hsieh (19:14)
I see, okay.
I see. Okay, okay, okay. And for our listeners that might be interested to learn a little bit more about like how this all works and how much I guess the biggest question is how much initial investment are we talking about to create a location like the one you just mentioned, with everything in place and the inventory.
David Wheeler (19:45)
I believe on the twenty twenty five franchise disclosure document, I specify that I want people to start with between three hundred and nine to four hundred and twenty-nine thousand dollars to open a store. You’re going to use approximately two-thirds of that to ⁓ buy your inventory, your fixtures, your signage, et cetera. and then I want you to have the other funds on hand to help you as operating expenses. Because you’re not going to be profitable day one.
Jason Hsieh (20:11)
Yes, yes, of course. Yeah. How long does it take to be profitable in the retail setting?
David Wheeler (20:17)
It it really varies on different factors, which I mean many some of which are out of our control. Yeah. For example, how well is your advertising going to reach your customers? Yes. And that can vary wildly. Widely. Not wildly. Well both. so I can’t really predict that. And that’s why I tell my franchisees.
Jason Hsieh (20:36)
Yeah. Yeah. But once you get into profitable stage, how much margin do you usually expect from the store owner?
David Wheeler (20:42)
Again, it’s going to depend and I really can’t go into that. Because I can’t do anything that seems like I’m promising a potential franchisee any certain result. I will say that people open stores for different reasons. I have one franchisee who is in a small town, a smaller town, and their reason for opening is they wanted a way to give back to the town and provide a community space.
They’re retired with other funds coming in. Yeah. So they are less concerned about margin than on investment in than in providing a service to the community.
Jason Hsieh (21:16)
I see, that’s another reason. Okay. Yeah.
David Wheeler (21:18)
Yeah. and different people open comic and game stores for different reasons. As long as they identify with the core principles and culture of the franchise. Yeah. And they’re in a place with enough population that I reasonably expect them to succeed, I’m happy to talk to them about opening a franchise. That number is between eighty to a hundred thousand people as a minimum.
Jason Hsieh (21:41)
population. Okay. Okay. I see. I see. I see. Okay. Very, very interesting. And ⁓ also if you have to share one piece of advice with someone that’s getting started within the toys and game industry, what would that be based on your experience, especially in the retail space?
David Wheeler (21:58)
Read a lot of books on finance. Make sure that you set up your QuickBooks data before you start opening. track your expenses before you open so that you are not scrambling three or four months down the road to try to put all that data in now.
Jason Hsieh (22:12)
yeah, yeah, yeah.
David Wheeler (22:13)
Work with a professional to put in the data correctly so that you don’t have to try to retroactively go in back and change it. Read books like Paco Under Hill’s Very Good Why We Buy, so that you can understand the way consumers move through a store and what motivates them to look at different areas. Goodness. You know, any basic financial books are a good thing.
I also one of the most important pieces of advice that I give to potential franchisees is to not discount. ⁓ Our margins are so small that we cannot afford to discount.
Jason Hsieh (22:47)
I see. Okay. Okay. Okay. I see. Okay. That’s all very solid piece of advice for someone that’s looking into getting into the retail space. And that’s very different than my background. It’s all e-commerce and everything digital. So that’s my background with all the different businesses I run. It’s everything is online. So
David Wheeler (23:06)
One of the things I point out to our franchisees is that everything we sell can be purchased less expensively online. So the reason that people come to our stores is they want the experience of being part of our community. Supporting a place that is owned and run by people who love the things that the customer loves as much or more than they do.
Jason Hsieh (23:18)
Yeah.
I see. Okay. Okay. That’s a good point. Yes. Yeah. Otherwise it’s very hard to be competitive with the ward of Amazon and everything going on, obviously.
David Wheeler (23:35)
Correct. Our customers come to us because they connect with us. So we need to provide as many opportunities for connection as possible.
Jason Hsieh (23:42)
Do you also run quite a bit of community based event in the store as well then?
David Wheeler (23:46)
Yes. We do. If you looked at the ⁓ calendar for any of my stores, any of the franchise stores, you will see that their community calendar is incredibly full. we do a lot of pre release events, we do Dungeons and Dragons nights. There’s something going on almost if not every night of the week at the store.
Jason Hsieh (24:05)
I see. Is there a location in the Arizona Phoenix area that you’re planning to open soon? ⁓
David Wheeler (24:14)
Not yet, but you know, if you would like to talk to me about being a franchisee there, I’d be happy to talk to you about.
Jason Hsieh (24:19)
I see, okay. Got it. Got it. Got it.
David Wheeler (24:21)
We support new franchisees with a hell of a lot of training. And ⁓ that goes on even after they are actual once they’ve opened their doors, we still do a lot of support.
Jason Hsieh (24:30)
Got it. Okay. Okay. Okay. Got it.
David Wheeler (24:32)
We have a weekly marketing meeting that franchisees can attend. we have a marketing contractor who we work with, you know, every day. We also do regular blog spots. so we also have so we also have two other franchisee meetings that are one is operations where people could come in and just ask questions for how things are working in their store. The other meeting is a strategic meeting where
franchisees get together on a call and talk about how the franchise as a whole is going to progress.
Jason Hsieh (25:01)
I see. Got it, got it, got it. So for those listeners and our audience that would be interested to learn more about your franchise and all the business you run, where’s the best place for people to find online?
David Wheeler (25:11)
Go to DLair.net and there is a tab there for franchising. and they’re also welcome to call me or email me, ⁓ CEO at DLair, Dragon’s Lair, basically DLair like DragonsLair.net, and I’ll be happy to respond to questions to the amount that I’m able.
Jason Hsieh (25:30)
I see. Okay. Thank you so much for that offer. And I’ll make sure we put that in the show notes well. And thank you again for your time, like sharing your story, your journey and your insight within the retail side of the business, within the toys and game industry. So thank you so much.
David Wheeler (25:45)
Thank you very much for inviting me. And for those of y’all out watching, thank you. I appreciate y’all too. We would not exist without y’all.
Jason Hsieh (25:52)
Yeah, thank you. And also for our audience, thank you so much for tuning in for this episode of Toy Business Unboxed Podcast. We hope you enjoyed our conversation and find it insightful and inspiring. If you like what you have heard, be sure to subscribe to our podcast on your favorite platform so you never miss an episode. We really appreciate your support and would love it if you can leave us a review and share with the podcast with your friend and colleague. For more resource, tips and the latest update within the toys and game industry.
Visit our website at toy-launch.com. Join the conversation and connect with us on social media using #ToyBusinessUnboxed. We’ll love to hear your feedback and suggestion for future episodes. Until next time, keep innovating, keep creating, keep bringing joys through toys. This is Jason Hsieh signing off on the Toy Business Unboxed Podcast. We’ll see you all in the next episode. Thank you so much, everyone.
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