How to Navigate the Toy Business Maze: Insights from Richard Spicer

EP021_05-09-24_Richard Spicer

Intro: [00:00:00] Welcome to Toy Business Unboxed, your gateway to the secrets of the toy industry. Here, Jason Hsieh, a toy entrepreneur and expert in the field. “Every product we develop is really inspired by some of the real life experience that we have with our son.” “60 percent of all toys last year were sold on Amazon.”

“Be passionate about it. Because it’s a road. It’s a journey.” “Like when you have an idea that you think is gonna somewhat change the world, make things better, I’d say go for it.“

Jason Hsieh: Hello, Welcome back to another episode of Toy Business Unboxed Podcast, where we unwrap the latest story behind the toy businesses and behind the wonderful businesses that supporting and making a differences in the toy industry. I’m your host Jason Hsieh. And today I’m thrilled to have Richard, the CEO of Pico Entertainment on the show and get ready as we [00:01:00] dive into an exciting world of toys and manufacturing.

And I think we’ll be talking a little bit about project management as well. Thank you for joining us today, Richard. It’s good to have you on the show. 

Richard Spicer: Hey, thanks Jason for having me on. It’s good to be here. 

Jason Hsieh: Can you first start off with the kind of tell us about your journey into the toy industry from your background. I see you have a lot of background working in Asia in the past as well. Can we start there? 

Richard Spicer: Yeah, definitely. If you want to go really far back, originally I come from a graphic design and running printing presses background. So when I first started off in the industry, I was doing book printing, which included stuff like, Dungeons and Dragons books and stuff like that.

So I, that was like my first job out of college did that for about four years and then ended up going and working for one of those companies that did D and D books. It’s actually a board game company, and that was my start into the whole toy industry. Because they not only touch 

Jason Hsieh: My son plays D& D.

Richard Spicer: Oh yeah, I actually still play it nowadays. I actually ran one of the only English language D& D groups out in Hong Kong. 

Voiceover: [00:02:00] Oh, whoa. 

Richard Spicer: But yeah, so I started working for this company called fantasy flight games, doing their production management. Working with different manufacturers around Asia, running logistics, doing quotations. Basically, that whole swath of communication between the U S team and the Asia team. I did that for quite a few years and then they had a, they were actually doing mostly hobby and they started to go into mass market. So they had interest from Walmart at one point to take one of their products.

As part of that, there’s the inspection and everything that needs to happen with the factory. Nobody had ever actually been out to the factories before to inspect them. I was basically told, Hey, Rich, you’re doing this. Do you know the most about it? We’re going to send you out and we’re going to do a pre checklist to make sure that we don’t have any problems. So I went out there, I spent a couple of weeks there and really enjoyed myself, I liked working directly with the manufacturers on things. And when I came back, I decided to actually move out to Hong Kong. So about six months later, now open book I may have. I’ve met my current [00:03:00] wife while I was on this trip, who’s also from the toy industry. She’s done everything from Toys R Us Animal Alley and even McDonald’s toys. 

I moved out there in 2008 and started working with the company called Huawei. So there are fairly, I would say second level below like Hasbro, Mattel, those guys more along the lines of like Jack’s Pacific and everything like that. At the time they were in need of somebody that was pretty organized, they had some recent successes with the robo lines, so RoboSapien, RoboRaptor. They had a whole slew of other stuff, but they were pretty disorganized. They had some communication issues, et cetera. And I came with some pretty good credentials from the states for getting things in line, because my previous company had also gone through a growth spurt and I helped them along to be able to expand their business out and grow in an organized matter.

So I took it upon myself to help these guys out. The first couple years I was handling scheduling and communications and reorganization. Mostly within the r&d section but it eventually [00:04:00] expanded out to all the departments that was there, Including like logistics, et cetera. And then eventually I ended up taking over the R and D department when the CTO at the time decided to move over to the Montreal office. So I became the de facto connection point between the Montreal team, which is all the, I would say the aesthetic design and then Hong Kong was the team that took care of the actual manufacturing and sorting things out. 

Jason Hsieh: That’s a very interesting, and it’s almost like a liaison for the design team, because sometimes the design thing come up with crazy ideas, not actually manufacturable. 

Richard Spicer: Definitely. But at the same time if you left, the factory to their own devices, they would also want the easiest product to produce and everything like that. So my job is, as being able to walk in between the two, I would find the happy medium between the two. I became very, involved with the R and D team. I was the main point of contact. I even did the sales engineering for them. I ran the showrooms for, 10 years or so.

Jason Hsieh: How [00:05:00] big is the catalog when you are part of the team before? How many toys do they have?

Richard Spicer: It really depended on year from year, but I would say from product line, not SKU, there would probably be about 10 new ones every year.

Jason Hsieh: Whoa, that’s a lot. The product line alone, that’s not SKUs. Thousands of SKUs. 

Richard Spicer: Yeah, we had quite a big catalog. We had a pretty big turnover to probably anywhere from 150 to 200 mil every year. Pretty decent size, I would say. But yeah I did presentations with Walmart, Target, Toys R Us while they were in their previous form. I also did all of the Europeans. I also did a lot of traveling around as well. I would go out to Japan to work with the Toys R Us teams out there. I traveled to Europe to do the toy shows there and also work with the different retailers out there as we could with packaging and things like that, to modify to what they need in there and then I even, opened up the China market for the company as well. So there was a big initiative at one point where they wanted to get into China. [00:06:00] So I spent probably a good half a year where I was on the train back and forth every single week going back and forth between the different towns, training and sales teams, et cetera.

Jason Hsieh: Did you also pick up some Chinese while you’re there? 

Richard Spicer: We’ll show you the end. 

I can speak a little bit. I’m very rusty now. I’ve gotten a little bit lazy cause my, my wife is from Hong Kong. She normally does a lot of the translation back and forth. But for a good amount of time, I had done a big crash course in Mandarin. So I could survive pretty well and do some business talk and stuff like that there.

I ended up doing that for quite a long time and then around. It was around 2020. The original owners of Huawei were taking a bit of a step back. They were getting old, they wanted to do retirement. And they were bringing their kids into the business. At that point they wanted to do more hands on type of stuff. So I took a backseat from there and provided more consulting services. And then in 2020, I moved back to the States and opened up a company called Pico [00:07:00] entertainment, which is 

Jason Hsieh: does a COVID play into that too? 

Richard Spicer: It does a little bit. There was a lot of factors. I had been there already for 12 plus years. I was looking for something like new to expand on and stuff like that. Work directly under one of the other owners that’s still over in Hong Kong and I had mentioned to him before that I was looking at expanding into other areas and stuff like that.

Jason Hsieh: What do you do with your current company exactly? 

Richard Spicer: It started off originally as doing development and manufacturing. So I have a small network of factories that I’ve worked with for the past 10 plus years that I know they do good work, they can translate ideas to actual products very easily. I wouldn’t say easily, but with not the same amount of problems you can get with just the factory that you sourced off of a random.

So we have that network, but then we also did that type of sourcing, but we go in and also vet their teams as well with discussing with them. I’m normally stationed here, but my wife would actually go off to Hong [00:08:00] Kong and China about twice a year and take a look at these new factories and stuff like that. She has her engineering team out there. She also resolves any problems out there. 

Jason Hsieh: Do you also attend a Canton Fair every single year too?

Richard Spicer: I don’t do the fairs as much. 

Jason Hsieh: Okay. 

Richard Spicer: Out in the, as far as I can. I did when I was working at Huawei. But from my position, it’s not an effective part of our time. 

Jason Hsieh: For the listener that’s not aware of the Chinese sourcing. Canton Fair is one of the biggest trade show in China. Actually, one of the biggest in the world. I don’t know, Richard, if you want to explain how big the Canton Fair is. 

Richard Spicer: It’s massive. I forget how many sections there are. I think it’s four, four to six, I think they were up to or something like that, but they’re basically small cities. When you go there, it’s mind blowing how huge it is. 

Jason Hsieh: I think the best way I can describe it for those of you that have been to the Las Vegas Convention Center times that by three times. The Las Vegas Convention Center multiplied by three, that’s about it.

Richard Spicer: Yeah, I think that would be a good comparison. 

Jason Hsieh: I think it lasts for a month [00:09:00] or I forgot how long it is. It’s first phase and second phase too.

Richard Spicer: Yeah and they split it up by like different categories and stuff like that. So it’s not just the same people. They’re shifting out every week and a half of new categories. One of my visits, I’ll go back and see how it’s developed. I’d be interested to see that. 

Jason Hsieh: How has your experience in Asia, which you have many years of experience working in Hong Kong and working with all the manufacturers in Asia.

How does that influence your current approach to manufacturing and also retail consulting when you’re working with the U S company right now? 

Richard Spicer: So I think a big part of it from my side is it goes back to my experience where I was that point person between the two sides. There’s the manufacturing side, which I have empathy for how they want to do things, but I also know from the state side, they have their idea on what their clientele need to be able to sell a product on the market. I look at four different pillars or four different circles and event diagram to make something [00:10:00] successful. You have your aesthetic stuff, which is normally provided by the U S team. You have your functions or your selling points, which you don’t want to go overboard on that, you want to have those functionalities that those it’s those three call outs on the box. Then you want to look at the manufacturability side of things. So that’s where you start getting that bit of overlap on there, but they can be a little bit separate. For example you have this great looking product, you made some samples, you send it over. It’s probably not going to be manufacturable the way it is. They may have like undercuts on the mold and when you start getting into that complexity, you start also having to relay back to your, client that, Hey, look we can make this as complicated as you want. However, once you start getting to break up pieces and having to do separate pieces in the mold, your price point is going to start going up, which means then you’re fighting against your SRP, that’s why you’re starting to get that overlap between those three and then you tie it off with the what we were originally talking about [00:11:00] when we met was the safety and Q. A. Q. C. Concerns that you have that’s also Something to take into account. I think that’s actually another big part of what we do right now, we were providing all those other services before. And then in this past year we’ve been working with having talks with STC. It’s one of the largest testing labs. They’re based in Hong Kong. It’s supported by the Hong Kong government. They wanted to be able to do more business development in the U S. I’d actually worked with them previously. When we got into these discussions and they decided they wanted to use us as their U. S. office and then we would help them do business development. So our company acts as the head of sales and business development for STC. 

Jason Hsieh: So I have a follow up question on that because part of what I do day to day is really helping Toy brand to launch on Amazon. And one of the biggest problem I usually face when I work with the brand.

Is when it comes to product testing, Amazon have [00:12:00] such a weird requirement and they sometimes changes. Does STC have a lot of maybe your company have a lot of experience providing the test report based on Amazon’s certifications and also Amazon requirement. And because a lot of times when we work with like the factory work with our brands they will talk to their factory, say, this is a report Amazon run it. The, factory was sending a report and then it missed a few items.

Then the whole thing gets rejected. Can you talk a little bit about your experiences not just testing report, but also specifically for Amazon, because Amazon is one of the biggest e commerce marketplaces we all know. 

Richard Spicer: When it comes to Amazon, that’s actually a big part of our business right now. Not only in toys, but like all products. The recent I think crackdown as far as having testing and stuff like that has been to try to stem the flow of products coming directly from Asia that don’t follow our safety certifications defender. So this past few years we’ve seen a huge ramp up in the restrictions, et cetera. That’s a huge part of our business. For all the individual tests, of course it’s going to be dependent on what product [00:13:00] that you’re selling. But typically you want to cover all your bases on there. You want to do your ASTM, of course, which is your standardized testing for the US. You want to do your CPSIA, which is the Consumer Product Information Safety Act items, which covers a whole nother swath of items, including labeling, et cetera. At the same time, you would also want to take care of your EN71 stuff, although that’s Europe testing. A lot of times I advise people to do both at the same time, just because they can use sections of the testing and then also doing stuff like your FCC, your Prop 65 for California, et cetera. They’re, going to want all of this stuff done.

Jason Hsieh: What do you see is the biggest advantage over using a separate testing lab like STC versus just working with the manufacturer itself? 

Richard Spicer: So here’s the big problem. I know a lot of the labs or a lot of the factories, they have their own small labs that they work with. The problem comes up when there’s a discrepancy in the [00:14:00] testing when you don’t have it. Those smaller testing labs may not be certified globally as far as being recognized as far as their testing is concerned.

For STC in general, they basically cover all of the different testing requirements. So it’s like your accreditation, like HKAS, CNAS, DACS, CPS CPSC, SATRA all of those, they’re worldwide recognized and it’s because, the Hong Kong government really wants us to be the standard testing lab that people use. So they make sure that they have all their I’s dotted and T’s crossed in order to make sure that happens. And when you do run into these problems with the smaller testing labs, it’s very easy for them to say Not our problem. Also, you didn’t ask for certain tests. 

That’s actually one of the big problems with dealing directly with a lot of these testing labs and factories is that sometimes they won’t tell you what testing you need. They’ll just say, you tell us what testing you want and that’s why us and [00:15:00] STC are able to work together because of our relationship we can go outside of the lab report, which is for their testing ethics, they should be customer asks for test. And then from there it’s a go, go, no go on that test. From our side, because we have a good idea of what the testing requirements are and also our engineering team back in China keeps a good eye on what’s happening. They’re able to provide like recommendations and things like that in order to be able to pass the tests. And then when they are reading the reports, they can go back directly with the manufacturer and say, Hey, fix this, fix that in order to be able to pass the testing. When you go with the smaller labs, they’ll just say your stuff is wrong. You have to fix it yourself. 

Jason Hsieh: And how was the experience dealing with Amazon so far? 

Richard Spicer: It’s actually not bad. We do a pretty good amount of business. We actually do a lot of the Amazon powwows. We have another local, we have a lab out in New Jersey, and we have a team out there that they go along to these various Amazon powwows. They have their booth there and they work with [00:16:00] a lot of clients being able to get their stuff all, passed for the requirements that Amazon needs.

Jason Hsieh: What is Amazon powwow? I haven’t heard of that term. 

Richard Spicer: It’s a sponsored event where it’s a meetup for anything Amazon related. They’ll have a bunch of people who sell on Amazon directly. I think the most recent one was down in Miami a month or two ago. They normally handle those ones and run around to the various shows and then they work with people who are selling on Amazon. It’s a meeting point, too, where they have different services with Amazon, like looking at sales history and algorithms and things like that to be able to. 

Jason Hsieh: Like Prosper show. Have you been to Prosper yet? 

Richard Spicer: No, I don’t think I have. 

Jason Hsieh: Prosper is actually one of the biggest Amazon seller conference. I’m pretty sure it’s a lot bigger than Powwow maybe. 

Richard Spicer: Oh yeah, definitely. I would imagine the Powwows are normally pretty small, but also from our side of things, we typically try to aim for the smaller to midsize companies. That’s really where our strong suit is. We don’t, [00:17:00] go after the very large retailers or anything like that. We like to work really closely with our clients. 

Jason Hsieh: I think it’s because when the toy company to a certain size, they have a in house, the testing team as well.

Richard Spicer: Yeah, they’ll eventually transition over. Which is always a good thing. You want to see them be successful. I always feel good about it because you’re like, yeah, I trained them up in that. They’re able to take off and do their own thing now and that’s another big thing that I do as well as the optimization and communication management. We were talking a bit before the show. I’m actually a PMP and also a scrum master.

Jason Hsieh: Yeah. Tell me more about that. I’m very interested to learn more. 

Richard Spicer: So I’ve been, as I mentioned before, I was doing like scheduling and stuff like that before, but effectively I’ve been a project manager since. Almost 20 years, not always with the certification, but in one form or another, I’ve been there. Throughout my toy history, I’ve not only done Your typical waterfall stuff, which is working with the [00:18:00] factory. There is the agile stuff, which is working with the development teams. And I’ve even done software development. So I’ve done apps and things like that as well. And that’s where I got my certification for Scrum Master.

Jason Hsieh: Interesting and I think before the show, we were also talking about all the different project management software you have used. 

Richard Spicer: Oh, yes. I’m not sure from your experience, but a lot of times companies will, start off their development and everything like that, and they’ll get to a certain point until they run into a problem. So they already have a preset way of wanting to run their projects and then we jump in. So one of the things I’ve been really good at is being able to jump onto their current platforms. We were listing off the different stuff I’ve done project management on. Monday. com, I’ve done Asana. My original background is doing Microsoft Project. 

I’ve also done Jira and I think they were used for a couple of years and then they dropped off into the ether. I would say from my standpoint, my two favorites are probably MS project because I am from that world. I know you’re like [00:19:00] that’s very old, but the other one that I, I liked a lot was Asana. Two are probably my favorite, but I’ll normally jump in and learn how to do whatever project management software the client is working on. And then later on, if they want me to improve on their optimization and communications, I’ll do recommendations. Not only my recommendation, but if they have a software that they really want to push through. 

Jason Hsieh: We do that too, Click Up actually all of the communications, within our project management system, any scene that’s communication, related to a specific task, live in the common session of that task. So there’s no email going back and forth at all. 

Richard Spicer: Yeah. And it gives you a good history as well. So if you need to pull back and find out what has happened, it’s much easier than sorting through an inbox and that is a little bit like herding cats. 

Jason Hsieh: Yes and based on my experience, I don’t know if you also experienced the same thing. It’s really not about the software. It’s about discipline on using the software. For example, like a lot of the challenges early in my entrepreneur [00:20:00] journey when I use different project management software is sometimes I have a team, but it’s everyone uses the project management software a little bit differently. It’s not consistent across the team. And that’s usually where the problem arises. For example, a lot of tasks either doesn’t have an assignee, doesn’t have a due date, doesn’t have an estimated time. Those are the requirements that I enforce on my entire team right now. In our project management system, every single task needs to have these three data.

Otherwise it doesn’t happen. If it doesn’t happen in our project management system, this thing never existed in our company. We really need to enforce that in order for it to work. 

Richard Spicer: And I would add on top of that one person accountable. One big problem I found is if you assign a ton of people to a task they’ll always assume the other person is taking care of it.

Jason Hsieh: Hundred percent. Yeah. 

Richard Spicer: One thing that I normally hammer down is who’s the one signing that the task is done at the end of the day. Okay, that’s the person going on there. You can ask whoever else you want for help. You have a cross functional team to be able to help you up, but we need to make one person [00:21:00] that’s being the accountable person for getting this done. And that’s a very big change of mindset. 

Jason Hsieh: 100% and the other thing I like to do is to create different automation across the processes within the project management system. Like for example, in ClickUp, I can just use today’s podcast as an example. The podcast, we have six different stages. Each different stages have different workflow and different SLP related to each stages. Right now we’re doing the recording. That’s a recording workflow. When we’re doing the scheduling, there’s a scheduled workflow SOP. And when we’re doing post production, there’s a post production related SOP and workflow. I’m in the fan of the SOP should live inside the project management software as well.

So it’s all in one place. Sometimes people have a whole separate SOP library. They need to go find stuff. It doesn’t always tie to the project management system. And I see that was a common disconnect based on the toy company I worked with in the past and even with my own toy company. So that’s another thing, I don’t know. Do you have any best [00:22:00] practice as far as integrating SOP with the project management system? 

Richard Spicer: Yeah, I would say, I’m a big fan of one point of truth and that typically ends up being the project management software. Whatever you end up using, it needs to be centralized and needs to be the one source of truth. For example, We had a company they were using asana and then they’re using train you all for a lot of their stuff off to the side. They also using SharePoint for other stuff. You can still have those tools available, but we need to pull that in all into one spot. So if you have one person, if you have a new person coming on. You point them to one place and they’re able to find all the information that they need to be able to get their job done. I normally do a running page of terms and definitions as the first thing that I do with all my clients is okay, you have a lot of terminology that you use within your company that may mean different things depending on who you’re talking to. What is a new item for you? What’s a reprint? Going down this list and figuring out what all that is. 

Jason Hsieh: And the beauty with AI nowadays, you can actually create an initial [00:23:00] draft of the SOP using AI. I use it all the time when I’m creating SOPs. And also, I don’t know for those listening that’s using Loom. Loom has the latest AI function. You can record a video of you doing a certain task. Then based on that video transcription, The loom can turn it into SOP, like written SOP, based on the video you recreated. So you don’t need to type everything out. You just record it one time. Everything using AI will be translated into a step by step SOP that your team can follow. So I’m 100 percent in favor of using more and more AI. I’m actually working on a book for using AI for toy marketing right now. 

Richard Spicer: I’m actually I’m on the side of pro AI. I think it’s a great tool. I think there’s some ways that it can be abused a little bit, but as far as being able to put things together really quickly like I end up doing a lot of Like, vendor profiles and stuff like that and being able to put that together really quickly and outlines. It’s very easy just to get an AI. It does your first draft for you and you are just able to go in and make the corrections that you need on their. 

Jason Hsieh: It’s really about like efficiency. And [00:24:00] of course, you always still want to have a human checkers and double check everything that’s written. It’s not going to be perfect, but you’ll get 80 percent of there.

Richard Spicer: Yeah, exactly. It did. Sometimes the grammar is a little bit wonky, but it doesn’t sound like a real person talking, but that’s okay. That’s easily fixed. But yeah, being able to do stuff like that really easily is, great. 

I am also a graphic designer, but when I want to start throwing out random ideas to get my mind moving along, I’ll use AI to come up with some generated images. I have a huge graphics tablet over onto the side here, so I’ll throw it up on one screen and then use that kind of as an inspiration to be able to do some of my actual design work 

Jason Hsieh: The next question I want to talk about is what is your goal for Pico Entertainment? For 2024 and maybe three years from now, where are you planning to take this company to and what are you working on to continue to make sure the company is growing and also helping with all the other businesses you are working with? 

Richard Spicer: [00:25:00] We are in a big stage of growth right now. Last time I checked, we were at about double our business of last year. Which makes makes us very busy but we both love it. Our plan for the next year is we have a few new options that we’re opening up. One thing is we have a warehouse. Our main goal is to be able to be start to finish we’re helping clients get their, product to market. Not the marketing side, I’m not an expert in that, but the actual getting the physical product out to the customer. 

We’re working with another partner right now, who I’ve worked with in the past to help guide the process. Who’s been doing warehousing for I want to say 20, 25 years. But yeah, they’re helping us out, picking out the spot and getting the required, being able to get the loading dock and everything like that set up correctly, but we’re looking that for probably within the next six to eight months and we’re actually starting on it. So this is the whole other side is, we not only have a client base, but we also do our own [00:26:00] products as well. 

Jason Hsieh: Oh, it’s similar to us. What is the category you are selling? 

Richard Spicer: Pet toys. 

Jason Hsieh: Pet toys. Okay. Got it. Are you selling on Amazon too? or are you selling it on? 

Richard Spicer: We’re not selling yet. So this is going into the future. We’re, actually at the tail end of development right now. We’re going to be at some trade shows later this year to start meeting with retailers. We’re looking at right now for brick and mortar and then expanding on to Amazon after that. 

Jason Hsieh: Let me know if you need some advice. I don’t do pets. 

Richard Spicer: Oh yeah, definitely. We separate the toys out as far as we do external clients only. So I don’t do any internal development of toys. I only do the part of sourcing and testing and doing merchandising organization, stuff like that. 

Jason Hsieh: Oh, so you have a lot going on. You have the in house brand you’re working on. There’s a consulting and also a warehouse, 

Richard Spicer: Very busy this this year, but I like it. It’s always fun to be able to do something [00:27:00] new and work on new projects, meet new people. Especially after getting shut down from COVID and everything to be able to go out and trade shows and meet clients in person and stuff like that. And create new connections. It’s great. 

Jason Hsieh: So winding down in today’s interview, the final question I always ask every single guest is if you have to share just one piece of advice to someone that’s just getting started in the toy industry, what would that be?

Richard Spicer: No matter how great your idea is, and I agree, the idea is going to be great. Don’t set that idea in stone, because it’s going to evolve over time as you look at these different aspects of being able to get to market. There’s so many different twists and turns that can happen while you’re developing this.

Don’t get too stuck on one idea. But still try to drive that idea forward and stay as close as possible, but don’t be afraid to change a little, bit to be able to adapt to not only what the market needs, but also what it needs to be to [00:28:00] get manufactured and out to hopefully your and customer’s hands. 

Jason Hsieh: That’s a really good advice. And I think speed to implementation is key. Because it’s too slow, someone else might already have the same idea. I know it’s already launched. Then you’re too late. 

Richard Spicer: I’ve seen designs get stagnated because they don’t want to change the design it’s, and you’re not able to manufacture it at that. So you end up doing a lot of back and forth. And by that time, the opportunity has already been missed in the market. So that’s why be flexible with the ideas that you have. 

Jason Hsieh: Where can the audience and the listener find you?

Richard Spicer: I’m not on social media a whole lot because I’m more on the manufacturing side, but if you ever want to see what we’re up to, you can go to pico-ent.com that’s our main landing place that we go. If there’s any specific questions or anything like that we’re on LinkedIn or you can always find our contact information directly on the website.

Jason Hsieh: Thank you so much for being on the show as a guest and sharing your knowledge and background [00:29:00] and experience in the toy industry with us today. Thank you so much. 

Richard Spicer: Definitely. Thanks for having me on. It’s been a pleasure.

Outro: You’ve been listening to Toy Business Unboxed, hosted by Jason Hsieh. Thank you for joining us and exploring the fascinating world of toys and the ingenuity behind them.

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